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Political Propaganda In Games


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#1 Sinke

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Posted 22 June 2006 - 11:58 PM

This game [edit: America's Army] was actually made to encourage people joining US army.  

While I don't want to be politically incorrect, I simpy can't play this game at the moment for reasons quite known to anybody who knows what US army did to their own country.

Or what their country did to them.

Edit by Tai: Edited to specify which game, as this was split from the game discussion thread.

Edited by taikara, 23 June 2006 - 03:35 AM.

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#2 a1s

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Posted 23 June 2006 - 12:03 AM

View PostSinke, on Jun 22 2006, 11:58 PM, said:

This game was actually made to encourage people joining US army.  

While I don't want to be politically incorrect, I simpy can't play this game at the moment for reasons quite known to anybody who knows what US army did to their own country.

Or what their country did to them.
and what would that be?
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#3 Sinke

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Posted 23 June 2006 - 12:08 AM

The first war in the 21. century where the leading country of peace and justice succumbed to the level of  mindless attacker, obssesed with terrorism they encouraged with their behaviour for decades.
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#4 Blood-Pigggy

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Posted 23 June 2006 - 12:16 AM

Oh please, don't be pretentious.
Besides, it's a game, nobody is going to join the army because of a game.
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#5 Sinke

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Posted 23 June 2006 - 12:27 AM

Actually, you are quite wrong, Blood Piggy. This game was made to encourage young kids to join the service.  

They don't even hide it!

The game is designed to provide young adults and their influencers with virtual insights into entry level Soldier training, training in units and Army operations so as to provide insights into what the Army is like. As in the past, the Army's success in attracting high-potential young adults is essential to building the world's premier land force. With the passage of time, elimination of the draft and reductions in the size of the Army have resulted in a marked decrease in the number of Americans who have served in the Army and from whom young adults can gain vicarious insights into the challenges and rewards of Soldiering and national service. Therefore, the game is designed to substitute virtual experiences for vicarious insights. It does this in an engaging format that takes advantage of young adults' broad use of the Internet for research and communication and their interest in games for entertainment and exploration.


In elementary school kids learn about the actions of the Continental Army that won our freedoms under George Washington and the Army's role in ending Hitler's oppression. Today they need to know that the Army is engaged around the world to defeat terrorist forces bent on the destruction of America and our freedoms.
-from America's Army official web-site -


While I have heard how much difficulties NATO countries have because people don't sing-up for joining their atrocities- I really don't think this game deserves a place in a world. I believe that is called freedom of speech, but since I always regarded that as the worst part of western societies, it would be ironic to use it.
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#6 Blood-Pigggy

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Posted 23 June 2006 - 12:28 AM

I didn't say it WASN'T made to convince people to join, I just said NOBODY is going to join because of a game.

And it's a pretty good game, why don't you play it instead of just refusing to because of what its supposed purpose is, don't judge it before you try it.
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#7 Sinke

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Posted 23 June 2006 - 12:37 AM

I don't play it because of my moral reasons. I don't hate Americans, but I really don't think this is anything else but mind control.

A group of neo-nazi once made a game where you were supposed to kill Jews in concentration camps. I don't think Americans are nazis, but my reasons of absidence of that nazi-game are similar to reasons why I refuse to play America's army.

To make it more clearly- if somebody would make an air-craft simulation where you would have to kill yourself in Twin Towers for goal, I wouldn't play it as well.
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#8 Blood-Pigggy

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Posted 23 June 2006 - 12:41 AM

But this game isn't about terrorism, it's about tactical conflicts.
There are no "briefings" or "history" around the battles you do, it's just a ordinary shooter with maps.
The most you get about militaristic history in the past years is a few little briefings before each tutorial.
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#9 Sinke

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Posted 23 June 2006 - 12:48 AM

As I have quoted before:

Quote

Today they need to know that the Army is engaged around the world to defeat terrorist forces bent on the destruction of America and our freedoms.


Without any bad emotions from my side, Blood-Pigggy, I really doubt that nation of Iraq are or ever were terrorists who wanted to destroy American values and society. It is a known truth that Eastern world is quite different from the world we know, but on the other hand they aren't all terrorists who did 9/11. I'm from Croatia, which was in war with Muslim country a decade ago ( Bosnia and Herzegovina ). They would most probably react on this claim.

Anyway, as you have said- this is only a game. I don't like it here, but I guess this is a free site.  :)
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#10 LCJr

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Posted 23 June 2006 - 02:56 AM

Pretty amusing getting a lecture on morals from a Croatian.  WW2 wasn't that long ago and obviously the Serbs haven't forgotten what happened.

#11 stijnelijn

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Posted 23 June 2006 - 03:00 AM

common now, this is not the only game made with help of the US army.

electronic arts made a real nice deal with them. Their pooping out this stuff all the time.


Us army wants to make kids think in some ways:

Fist of all they want to bypass the first kill stun. Where young guys get totally shocked when they really kill or have to kill an enemy. With mass compgame killing in the kids life this shock gets bypassed and the kids will have little problems killing their enemies.

Secondly they want to make the army look like a cool looking place, lots of action and cool people who help eachother no matter what. Denzel Washington stuff etc.

There prolly a few more things they want to archieve but its 5 in the morning now for me. I just want to say its just annother brainwashing program. More effective then you may think.

#12 Blood-Pigggy

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Posted 23 June 2006 - 03:28 AM

Have you ever killed someone?
Do you really think a game is going to remove that shock of killing a person? Hell no, it's a video game, shooting people in a video game is like shooting tin cans with a BB gun.
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#13 taikara

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Posted 23 June 2006 - 03:33 AM

I have split this topic from the America's Army game discussion thread.

Although I would like to encourage discussion (and thus the reason for splitting the topic), I must warn you all to be as polite as possible with this discussion. As it is political, it has the potential of getting out of hand, and just so you all know in advance, I will deal strongly with anyone involved if it does get out of hand.

Making offensive remarks towards anyone's culture or country will not be tolerated - this is a form of prejudice akin to racism, as people are often strongly sentimental towards their country of origin.

It is perfectly okay to criticize negative aspects of a certain country or culture, but make sure to do so constructively, and with respect. Every country and culture has both positive and negative aspects, and you know what they say about throwing stones...
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#14 cheesegrater

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Posted 23 June 2006 - 04:23 AM

The game is blatant propaganda glorifying the US army. Very sad.

Hey, if you reviewed America's Army, can you also review this game? It is also freeware.

http://en.wikipedia....wiki/KZ_manager

#15 Tom Henrik

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Posted 23 June 2006 - 09:48 AM

Speaking as someone who has been in the military, and is actually trained to be a member of a military action force and be deployed whenever there is gunfire to strike down the opposing force (basically what you do in a FPS game), I have to say this:

I would rather join the American Army than the Norwegian one.

While there will always be political aspects of any country's military force, the military is not the ones to blame for the politics.

The military only does what they are ordered to do. And they always recieve thourough briefings about an area before they are deployed there. This involves historical backgrounds, religious groups (and what they believe in and why this causes conflict), and expected opposing force.

When a soldier is on a mission, he always believe that what he is doing is the right thing, and that it needs to be done. Sure, there are psychopaths and other extreme cases who are there only for the "fun" of it - but they are usually spotted and thrown out really quickly.

The soldier who thinks that he is doing the right thing - does so based on his own moral and the briefing he has recieved before the mission.

This means that the briefing holds the key here. With the right briefing, you can convince anyone to think they are doing the right thing. And, again, the military itself does not make these briefings. Do you really think that the Sergeant who pushed you through the obstacle course every rainy evening suddenly is an expert on Irak?

Not very likely, but he will be the one performing the briefing, because he is the one who's orders you will need to follow on the battlefield. He is the one you have come to think of a "parent figure" in the military. He is the one who pushes you to the max, and he will push himself likewise to protect you. And he will be there for you, both to scold you for doing something wrong, but also to support you when you are having serious problems.

Reason I would join the American Forces instead of the Norwegian one, is because the American Army really takes care of you and your family. You recieve good pay, you get medical welfare for you and your family, they pay for your education, and so on.

The Norwegian one didn't do anything for me, except teaching me how to fire a plethora of weapons. And it paid 10 bucks a day. Sure you get your meals and bed for free, but once you get out, you really are back to square one without any savings.

And this is just comparing the recruit/private years. If you were to make a living in the military and go up the ranks, you would ofcourse get more money, but you really don't need to do that in America to still get a lot of benefits.

And who says that if you join the American Army, then you are immidiately sent to Irak or Afghanistan?

They do have the Country Protection Force as well, you know. In which case you never leave the country, but is deployed if America gets invaded - or to act as a humanitarian aid to the American people (for instance when a natural disaster strikes a city, like flooding, earthquake, tornado, etc.) to help rescue people and use military equipment, like helicopters and mobile hospitals, to save people's lives. They will also act to help the police deal with riots and extreme looting, if the situation goes out of hand for the police to deal with.

Or you could just be a Military mechanic and work in a garage somewhere and fix vehicles.

There is a lot to every country's military, it doesn't just involve war. And the military doesn't choose who they go to war against, politicians do.

Yo!



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